Do you have a horror story regarding music contracts you have been involved in, or near misses? Please share your experiences here and help illuminate us all!
Thanks to Steve P. for suggesting this.
30 thoughts on “Contract Hell!”
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Duval Howitzer Publishing contract. The contract I was sent is 100% Non Exclusive and I actually got this guy to change the contract from until the songs become public domain which is 70 years after the writer dies to a flat out 24 months. I also had him change another thing in there saying they could rearrange, rename, rerecord the songs anyway they want and put their name on it. I think that part is typical in these contracts but he changed it. Anyhow I still wasn’t happy and said I still had to seek out an attorney. Now I have one who is going to check it out for me. I did ask this person from Duval who I am speaking with twice and never a name so that I don’t like. But if the contract is solid to the lawyer or can be negotiated I may sign it. Mine is for 75 songs. Fortunately I have a Super powered lawyer who him and his firm have recently done work for the band TOOL so I’m in really good hands. In the future when he tells me whats up I will be more than happy to share my experience. It seems like this guy has put some different contracts out there though and I said I even started negotiating mine on my own. He seemed easy about changing things though so we will see what the lawyer thinks and go from there.
hi my name is tony i produce hip hop instrumental tracks,
i received a 1000 instrumental (100 tracks per year) contract from duval howitzer (dh publishing) im hesitant to sign cause i read alot of bad feedback on the web about them,
im in a wheelchair (muscular dystrophy) so i dont work and cant afford a lawyer,
can you let me know if your lawyer thinks these guys are legit
Hey my friend. My lawyer did not like his contract so he rewrote it and I sent it back to Duval. Mr Canon of Duval said he would do it except the term had to be until public domain instead of 2 years. My lawyer didn’t like it so I then offered Mr Canon to sign our new contract except with less songs he wouldn’t come down on the song number or the until public domain clause so I didn’t sign with him. The original contract he had sent was absolutely full of bad stuff so if you can’t have it looked at then I wouldn’t sign this one. Its a very complicated contract with a lot of red flags.There is an organization here in Chicago where you can get pro bono legal assistance. Its called LCA Lawyers for Creative Arts. Look it up, maybe there’s something like that by you. Feel free to ask me any questions although it can take quite a while for me to write back. Good luck.
Myspace.com/shannonrichardsonband
Myspace.com/shannonrichardsonmusic
I am glad I did a google search; the first place I came was this discussion group. I was also skeptical because of never hearing of this ‘internationally known’ Mr. Cannon. I am a comedian and was contacted through ReverbNation: “I am looking for comedy skits to place in tv,radio,movies, websites around the world, web casts,etc. 1 of my placement firms had 1/10th of 1 million placements for tv alone in “09”. He included some terms of the contract. I wrote back requesting additional information and all I got was “email address? I want to email you a publishing contract” Seems rather hasty as I asked for more info, not a contract. Went to their website which was the FIRST red flag. Odd statistics and was curious how my comedy skit was going to be placed in a movie or tv…
Hi. I just got a message from this duval howitzer publishing company myself.
It seems as if this guy is looking for ppl who don’t have any clue about the ind,
He is picking people qwho he thinks he can con into a contract, How I know this.
I am a poetry writer my work is already copy write. and he randomly picks out ppl,
Who write anything, Screen writers, poetry writer, ppl who write novels.
Than wants to send them a contract for all rights to there work. Whether or not they get payed for it. I am very leary of ppl whom do this. Most Normal publisher’s do not go,
and look ppl up at random. You have to submit your work to them.
And as far as I know, Music publisher don’t send contracts to ppl who don’t write music.
Like I said I am a poetry writer, Not a music writer, and he wants to send me a contract.
For what I don’t know. But in my gut feeling, This company and it’s Mr.Cannon is not to be.
Treusted for any reason!
Dh publish Mr. connon seems to be a con artist try to pick un people like us. he doesnt sign anything and sends a contract in a hurry without know who the hell I am.
I think so too
If you’re not an attorney then you have no business at all evaluating a contract with a view towards its copyright or legal implications. I keep wondering when you “legal experts” are going to get into medicine and advise the unwashed and holy on the art of a heart-lung transplant.
Stick to creating music or that noise pollution you call music, let someone with an actual license to practice law advise and consult on a contract.
Does anyone have experience in licensing directly to the end user and handling the negotiations and contracts themselves?
How would you determine your costs?
Are their contract templates you would modify to suit, or would you rather hire a lawyer to draw up the paperwork?
Something smella at DH Publishing. Run
i was offered a publishing deal and don’t understand the contract i am nervous about signing it duval howitzer publishing co is who offered me the contract and it says a standered publishing contract what shoul i do
Read the above comments. All valid points whether it’s Duval Howitzer or any company. If you are at all unsure find a good entertainment attorney.
mm i been invited 2 on that “DH publising” mm i decided 2 investigate about the record company , i found just 2 artists on the company, these are christian,, but idk seems like weird cause that record company doesnt have tons of friends or subs on youtube, it doesnt have comments,(it has around 7 friends & 2 subs i guess) i check out the links of the channel, like myspace & the official web page but im not 4 completly sure of it D: i mean if that company would b hollywood records or that kind of rec. co.’s should have even more people on theyre pages ,, :/ till that i said idk 2 the message cause i wasnt sure of saying yes 2 someone by internet, i knooow is stressfull cause seems so good 2 b true but seems weird 2 :/ maybe i just have 2 wait a bit ,,, GOd bless 2 everyone, & guys if u get information bout thiss company, PLEASEEE TELL USS D: cause this is kinda serious :/
@ Boom. Yes that is accurate and I have a deal like that in the UK as well as US exclusives. But you either take an advance and share 50/50 in everything including sync and (if so) mechanical OR take the fee and just share performance.
Hi Chris – it;s nice to hear your experience – but In my experience this is not always the case (well in MY experience – never the case).
I’ve produced for both Extreme & KPM on the basis of a fee. This fee does not in anyway eat into my share of license fees.
It is in fact totally right that your time be paid upfront by a non-recoup able fee – not advance.
Of course – not many libraries offer fees, and go for advances, this I can live with / work with .. but you will know a sh*t library because they will refuse to pay either – and ask for exclusivity.
Exactly!
Just so I understand. You are saying you’ve written tracks for those libs, gotten a fee (or non-recoupable advance), retain 100% of your performance royalties, and share 50% sync or other licenses?
Yup that’s right ! – and that is how it should be..
Although – what used top be as standard – is now often a matter of negotiation.
If you have a product they want – you can negotiate a better deal, naturally.
The other thing is – once you have proved yourself a number of times – then you will be commissioned to write on projects .. again – I work with a range of the top UK libraries – and the upfront remuneration will either come as a ‘fee’ (no recoup) or ‘advance’ (which is basically a loan)
In the case of an advance – it is paid off with the mechanicals – you begin earning performance right away, of course.
However – with the proliferation of the low end industry – (freeby no advance to the composer – lo/no license fees for clients etc etc – basically a wide spread American model, now spreading internationally) – the more professional, traditional UK model is more and more under threat..
I see the whole Library industry going into the toilet – this decade.
OK but that’s not standard practice. If you can negotiate these things: a fee (not advance), 100% writers, and 50/50 sync and mechanical, then more power to you but no one offers this setup.
Sorry that’s me. ^^^
We’ve all seen them…licensing or publishing agreements that are really worth reading carefully. Here’s one of the recent ones that I decided to pass up (I’ll only point out the key points). My comments added with ***BOLD***:
1) Term: The “term” is the length of the agreement.
· Agreement is binding until said composition or said musical work becomes public domain. ***YIKES! THAT’S A VERY LONG TIME!!****
(2) Territory:
· Worldwide Territory
(3) Scope & Compositions:
· This deal is for 5 single composition(s). ***YET THIS GUY NEVER EVEN HEARD ANYTHING FROM ME!***
(4) Ownership:
THE WRITER OWNS 100% OF THE MASTERS.***YES, UNTIL YOU SIGN THIS AGREEMENT!***
· Under this standard music industry publishing deal, the writer assigns all copyrights to the [Company name removed by moderator] has exclusive administration of the songs throughout the world and controls all of the publishing and all of the master(s). · Writer hereby irrevocably and absolutely assigns, transfers, sets over, and grants to [Company name removed by moderator], its successors, and assigns each and every and all rights and interests of every kind, nature and description in and to the results and proceeds of Writer’s services hereunder, including, but not limited to the titles, words, and music of any and all original arrangements of musical compositions in the public domain in any and all licenses relating thereto, together with all worldwide copyrights and renewals and extensions thereof, which musical works have been written, composed, created, or conceived, in whole or in part, by Writer alone or in collaboration with another or others, and which are now owned or controlled, directly or indirectly, by Writer, alone or with others, or as the employer or transferee, directly or indirectly, of the writers or composition, ad all worldwide copyrights and renewals and extensions thereof, all of which Writer does hereby represent are and shall at all times be [Company name removed by moderator] sole and exclusive property as the owner thereof free from any adverse claims or rights therein by any other person, firm or corporation.·
Writer acknowledges that, included within the rights and interests herein above referred to, but without limiting the generality of the foregoing, is Writer’s irrevocable grant to [Company name removed by moderator], it’s successors, licenses, sub licensees and assigns, of the sole and exclusive right license, privilege, and authority throughout the entire world with respect to the said original musical compositions and original arrangements of compositions under the public domain, whether now in existence or hereafter created during the term hereof as follows:
————
***ANOTHER RED FLAG***
(b) To substitute a new title or titles for said compositions or any of them and to make any arrangement, adaptation, translation, dramatization or transportation of said compositions or any of them, in whole or part, and in connection with any other literary, musical or dramatic material, and to add new lyrics to the music of any said compositions or new music to the lyrics of any of said compositions, all as [Company name removed by moderator] may deem expedient or desirable;
***SO, THEY CAN RE-TITLE AND RE-ARRANGE YOUR TRACK AS THEY DEEM `DESIRABLE’ AND YOU’LL NEVER SEE A PENNY FROM THE NEW TRACK!***
***BOTTOM LINE…Always know exactly what you’re giving away, BEFORE…you give it away.
Most of what i read above is standard in the music industry, as far as dealing with a music publisher. But most people have not hired a entertainment lawyer, so they read a contract and throw out the baby with the bath water…because: they are not trained in the arts of music contracts. How can you show us 1/2 of a page of a contract and expect us to think that this contract is no good ?
What more do you need to see? This company expects someone to sign an exclusive agreement in perpetuity , transfer all rights, with no reversal clause, and no guarantee of any money whatsoever.
Would you read past what is posted here? If so, I’d be curious to hear the logic.
2nd. Most good libs own the tracks forever and that’s why you get a fee per track. And some libs don’t need to hear much. If your stuff is competent they just brief you and you go away and do it. This seems like more hating on libs and slight paranoia. The exclusivity you are speaking of is re: the masters not your employment which is what ^^^ seems to imply. And as far as guarantees? Nothing is guaranteed. Think about it…you can’t guarantee a use in anyway it’s crazy.
And pls read my retitle article on the home page for some thoughts on why ^^^ is better.
Chris,
I understand that this contract refers to the tracks being exclusive for this company, not my employment with them.
Regarding a guarantee…All I was asking was why anyone would sign an exclusive contract, basically handing over their songs and copyright, without a hefty advance, or at least a way out of the agreement if nothing happens within 3 years. Am I really asking for too much?!!!
I dunno. Most libs buy the track and own them forever. Those are the ones with good clients IMO. It depends on your view. Me personally? I don’t want an advance from a company unless they are big. Re: exclusively repping your master forever without a fee? Yeah, that’s whack. But buying the track’s copyright and exclusively owning forever with 100% writer’s performance going to you is normal.
Obviously there’s normal & there’s normal.
What has been normal in the UK for the proper libraries is this.
Library pays production fee or advance – per track or per album.
Library then owns copyright on the works for the period of copyright.
Writer and Publisher split all proceeds 50/50
That’s normal – 2 me.