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Newbie Questions

One of our readers, Ev, came up with the suggestion to have a section devoted to newbie questions regarding music libraries, music licensing, copyright, music publishing etc. There a lot of experienced people on this site and many are happy to share their wisdom. So, if you are a newbie (or not), and have a question, try leaving it here.

Of course many questions have already been answered here. First try searching in the search bar in the upper right hand corner. Also Google is your friend! I have found one of the best ways to search a site is use site specific criteria at Google’s web site. In other words, to search for a specific keyword, say “contracts”, type it in at Google like this “contracts site:musiclibraryreport.com”. Do not use the quotes.

If you still can’t find your answer then leave a comment here and someone will most likely come to your rescue!

1,260 thoughts on “Newbie Questions”

  1. Responsibility: where do we draw the line?

    The great thing about this site, as Art recently said, is how we all encourage each other. There is no denying, that is a good thing. But where do we draw the line? Do those of us who’ve been in those business a long time have a responsibility to offer realistic and unvarnished advice, or should we just be cheerleaders?

    I expect newbies to be enthusiastic. They’re still on the honeymoon. I expect young people to be young people. It’s completely normal for a 20-year old to think that they are the hottest beat generator on the planet. They have plenty of time to sink or swim, and perhaps not so much to lose.

    But, I’ve noticed a disturbing trend of older writers, some with family responsibilities, or who have lost a job or been laid off, who seem to think that licensing music is the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

    I guess I’m asking fellow writers who are succeeding, if we should not be more open about the odds? And about how long it’s likely to take to earn a living wage. And, perhaps the likelihood, or not, of earning a living wage.

    One writer, Matt, has laid out a timeline that it took for him to reach 150K — about ten years.
    But keep in mind, Matt is the exception. Not everyone who has been writing for 10 years is making anywhere near that.

    Erwin (50 Styles), AudioSparx top writer, stated that his primary income is from his music business, not library music.

    Just my two cents, but when people are pinning their hopes and dreams on making a living library music, especially if they’ve lost a job and are in dire straights, I think we need to be encouraging, but honest. If we are not honest, we may do more harm than good.

    Few people would lose a job today and think, oh I’ll start practicing medicine, or I’ll try out for the Yankees. I know that this isn’t the same thing, but on the level to which El Jol refers, top exclusive libraries, it is analogous to the big leagues. The reality is you have to be prepared to invest substantially to work at that level. It is not the same thing as posting a handful of tracks and waiting and hoping for money to hit your Paypal account.

    Those of us who earn a living making music are truly fortunate. Again, it’s just my two cents, but I’d like to know how other writers feel about this issue. There’s a fine line between discouragement and honesty, where do we draw it?

    Best to all,

    Michael

    • I guess this is a crack at me. I know that I may have been a bit naive or maybe even unrealistic. But I think it is still wrong to kick someone while he is down. Just because some of us are not successful does not mean that we should be teased. Reading some of MichaelL’s recent posts has kind of given me the impression that he thinks he is better than us. I just don’t understand what the superior attitude is for. Everybody else is helpful without being a jerk. Whatever!

      • Not at all Eddy. It’s not a crack at you. I’m sorry that you feel that way.

        I was afraid that my posts would be taken the wrong. NO I don’t think that I’m superior. NOT AT ALL.

        I’ve been in this business for 30 years. I’ve taught music business courses at the college level. I am an attorney, and I’ve lectured on entertainment law at the college level. As a musician and composer, I’ve seen the ups and downs good and bad AND the ugly. The UGLY is why I became a lawyer.

        I DO NOT think that I’m superior.

        But let me ask you a question. Wouldn’t you rather that someone told you straight up how hard this business is, and how slim the odds of making a living are BEFORE you started?

        That’s what my post is about. How do those of us who’ve been around the barn HELP people before they potentially harm themselves.

        I’m sorry that you feel that I think that I am superior, or that I attacked you. My concern is how do those of us who are professionals adequately communicate the nature of the business to those entering it. I believe that we have a responsibility to present the business without rose-colored glasses so that people can make informed choices, and know what they’re up against.

        I’ve been where you are Eddy. I’ve had royalty statements that wouldn’t even buy a cup of coffee, and I’ve had some that would buy a car. I’ve stuck at it 30 years. That’s what you need to do. It’s way too soon to be feeling like you failed. You didn’t. You made a few dollars writing music AND that’s more than most people do!

        Best of luck yo you.

        Michael

      • Hey Eddy,

        I know you’re down at the moment and I’m sure you’ll get through this and make the right decisions for you and your family, whatever they turn out to be.

        I can see how MichaelL’s post would feel like a kick in the guts for you at the moment, but IMO he’s one of the most helpful and realistic contributors here. I know it doesn’t seem like that right now, but he is trying to ask some tough questions that need to be asked and I believe you’ll be able to see that and appreciate it soon enough.

        All the best mate, whatever you decide.

        • Thank you Rob. Please read my follow-up to Eddy.

          My post was generated out of concern NOT disdain for composers in Eddy’s position.

          I believe that those of us with experience need to demystify the process as much as we can.

          It’s good to encourage, but we need to be brutally honest as well.

          To object is to help writers to learn and pace themselves, so they don’t depend too heavily on this business on the front end — and then feel badly, as Eddy is now.

          Best,

          Michael

          • I understand, Michael, and I agree. I don’t know Eddy’s situation at all but as a noob to this game myself, I’ve come to realise a thick skin and the inner acceptance of knowing I’m meant to do this are pretty much non-negotiable assets. A long hard road with no certainty of ever earning a living from this, ought to be regularly sign-posted on the way. 🙂

            I’m not long off finishing year 1 myself and nowhere near far enough down the road as I would like.

            As always, I find your posts among the most down-to-earth, realistic and helpful. Thank you!

      • @Eddy L. The last thing MichaelL would have is a superior attitude. He’s one of the many very helpful people on MLR. The fact is that it is a tough business. I will mention again (ad nauseam) that I have been at the music biz game for decades and while I have had my share of successes making music, the music library game is one of the toughest I’ve been in.

        • So from what I gather, patience and persistence are the only way to be successful in the music library business? I guess that I will have to see if I have those abilities within myself. I guess that when you are down like me, being told about patience and persistence are the last things that you want to hear. When you are in my sitiuation, you really want a golden ticket or a quick & easy way to gain success. But I guess that if I have any chance at becoming successful with my music, I will have to continue to crawl through the mud for a few more years.

          Thanks.

          • You are correct Eddy, there is no “golden ticket, or quick and easy way.”

            Here are some things in no particular order that appear to result in success.

            1) Quantity: Having a lot of tracks. Matt (a successful writer) stated that he has approaching 2000 tracks. Barbie from AudioSparx says that her most successful writers have at least 500 tracks. You’ll notice that Bjorn Lynne (who also owns Shockwave) has 7000+ tracks on AudioSparx. Denis Woods has 416 tracks on AudioSparx. It IS a game of quantity. A few placements here and there will not put you on easy street.

            2) Quality: at some point it DOES matter. In a thread, a long time ago,the owner of Audio Socket said “buy the best sounds that you can afford” There is a difference between East West, Vienna, Symphobia and the stock sounds in a keyboard or Garage Band. Notice that Erwin (50 Styles) AudioSparx top seller uses Protools. Are there people selling music without high end gear? Yes. Is there a point at which you need those tools to go further? Yes, especially if you want to get into the exclusive libraries that El Jol mentioned.

            3) Variety: a lot of people talk about branding and specialize in one genre. But my observation is that the most successful library writers write in many genres.

            4) Library music does have a lifespan. Yes, there are anecdotal stories about the occasional piece of music that earns money for decades. My experience is that unless the tracks are timeless, the royalties will grow and then decrease over time. That is especially true on tracks that are “trendy.” How much use do you think “Seinfeld” soundalikes are getting today?
            This is why it’s good to write in many, perhaps 50, styles. (sorry Erwin, but you are a model of success). There will come a time when trip-hop and dub step will be as antiquated as doo-wop. If you’re a one genre writer, you must plan for the day when your genre is passe.

            5) Sacrifice: When I was in law school, one of the professors said that how well you succeed as a lawyer depends on how much you’re willing to give up to get there. Music is no different –from the beginning. How many hours are you willing to practice your instrument and study, instead of playing football or watching television? Are you willing to have a less expensive car to have a more expensive studio? Are you willing, or able to spend hours and hours writing, instead of with family or friends? I read on this thread that Matt put in 12 hours a day, six days a week — for years — to build his catalog (maybe that’s an urban legend).

            So, no, there’s no “golden ticket” or “easy way.” But, now you know. If you choose to go forward, it’s an informed choice. AND — this is the important part — there’s no guarantee.

            Writing library music is a investment. Like any investment, you have to measure your tolerance for risk. There are a lot of factors that affect that. How much responsibility do you have? Do you support others? Do you have other sources of income (like a working spouse / partner)? Don’t forget health insurance in the U.S.

            On the personal side, how do you handle rejection, disappointment? As Rob said, you need a thick skin. Are you too close to your music? Can you write it, let it go and move on?

            Again Eddy, I’m sorry if you thought that I was attacking you. I wasn’t. You got a placement, which is more than most accomplish. What upset you is that it didn’t pay much. But that’s not you’re fault. And, it’s no reflection on the quality of your music. The fact that someone LIKED IT ENOUGH, to use it is.

            And, I’m sorry if you thought that writing library music is a golden ticket, or an easy way to make money — it simply is not. I don’t want anyone to feel as badly as you’re feeling now –as a result of this business –if it can be avoided. The point of my original post was that those of us with experience need to make the “facts of life” in this business abundantly clear to new writers, while at the same time remaining encouraging. It’s a delicate balance.

            Best of luck,

            Michael

            PS.

            @Art and @Rob –thanks.

            • Slow down man! Thanks MichaelL. That information gives me a great deal to consider. I really need to read what you posted a few times to try to absorb the great deal of vital information you gave me. Hopefully I can find a way to make sense of things and will come to a conclusion soon. Maybe this break is what I need.

              • Hey, it gave me a break from setting up a LASS template in VEPRO!

                Are you in the UK? What are you doing up at 4:30 am?

                Read and absorb.

                Cheers,

                Michael

            • @MichaelL

              Great post. Agree with it all really. I think those of us who have been around a while on this forum need to be positive to newcomers as well as realistic. Its a fine balancing act as you know. Here are a few of the personal and professional attributes i think are important.

              1. I have to be able to take rejection and disappointment on a regular basis. If I couldn’t then what’s the point in ruining my life for music. You only live once. I hopefully have been able to develop a positive attitude to all of this. Do I get solemn/down/depressed. sure I do but I do believe that I am going forward. If I take a longterm view on this I can see my progression.
              Unfortunately to take a long term view you need to be quite old 🙂

              2. To make a living in this game I need to be able to write in more than one style. I like Erwin just like doing a few different things Rock/Pop/Dance NewAge/Celtic etc. Some work some dont.

              3. You made the point about investment in equipment. Absolutely. I have a Protools HD3 rig plus Logic etc. It costs a lot of money, but to compete in the business I am in, I have to invest in it. Do you need this precise setup to write music of course not, but eventually if you are doing this as a career, you will.

              I will end on a positive note. I really felt for EddyL in his post and it got me thinking about this crazy career I am in and how financially insecure it is, early in the week. As I was musing about this I got an emai, 2 sales on Audiosparx which propels me into the number 2 spot under Erwin. I have only been with Audiosparx for 10 months, if I can do it anybody can.

              Sometimes I need to remind myself of what I have actually done, rather than what I think in the moment. Also incredibly I am getting a Pro check for tens of thousands of dollars for a commercial I wrote over 10 years ago which hadn’t ben cue sheeted properly, so had been sitting there for a number of years unpaid.

              All of this happened in 24 hours. The moral of the story and to paraphrase Art “The next email or phone call you get could be your next gig” The trick is to stick around long enough to receive it.

      • Hey Eddy, hang in there pal. Remember, we do this because we love making music! That’s the key.

        Yeah, it’s not easy reaching say the 150-200k a year mark but it IS possible and that’s what’s exciting. I know several writers who earn that who have been struggling really hard at times. On the verge of giving it up in fact.

        The chase for the prize is quite an interesting, rollercoaster ride. I mean, we don’t want it handed to us on a plate do we? Stay with it Eddy! The wonderful thing about library is that anything is possible!!! 🙂

    • I understand what Michael is saying… I don’t think he was trying to be an ass or anything. He makes some valid points, and I’d like to share my 2 cents on the “making a living with library music” topic. Not directed at anyone in particular, just general info for people to consider.

      I make probably 98% of my living from writing music. I work a part time job here and there for extra money and to have something I can go to for quick cash should catastrophe strike, but for the most part I wake up everyday and write music for libraries and/or commercials. I am currently in what I consider my 4th year of being “in business” in the music library field.

      I am by no means making a ton of money, but I think I’m doing pretty well considering how long I’ve been at it and my “business” is continuing to grow. I do have a few huge advantages over a lot of the “older” writers that MichaelL mentioned that I think should be known and taken into consideration by all who decide that they want to try to write music for a living.

      These huge advantages are:

      (1) I am young (in my 20’s) and healthy.
      (2) I am not married
      (3) I do not have any children… well, none that I know of (jk of course)
      (4) I don’t have a mortgage, much less one that I am under water on. I rent.
      (5) The city I live in has a cheap cost of living, especially compared to places like NYC & LA
      (6) My car is paid off, and I am debt free. Also, my car is a small, cheap car that gets good gas mileage and is cheap to repair. Not a babe magnet, but it gets me around.

      Some of those advantages might not seem like a big deal to a lot of people, but IMO they make all the difference. I remember about 2 years ago a very successful composer friend of mine said to me “I don’t think you will have to work a day job for too much longer, because you are young and can live on very little money.”

      Being able to live on very little money for at least a year or two is almost mandatory IMO. Everybody that I can think of who is a successful composer making a comfy living had a period of time where finances weren’t so great. In my experience and opinion, you want to get to the point where you can write music all day, every day as soon as possible. Thats when things start to really get rolling, and that transition from part time composer with a day job to full time composer probably isn’t going to happen without taking a bit of a pay cut for a few years.

      So who is better positioned to take a pay cut? A 25 year old single person who can live on next to nothing? Or a 45 year old who is married with children, has a $2,000 mortgage payment every month and 2 gigantic SUV’s in the driveway? The answer is obvious.

      If you aren’t a 25 year old who can live on next to nothing, that doesn’t meant hat you can’t write music and be successful at it. Its just that your timeline will be different, and you probably will want to adjust your short term and long term goals accordingly. I know some great composers who aren’t full time, but they are making headway slowly but surely. Their credits, connections, and income from music are growing steadily. Just don’t let yourself get overwhelmed and frustrated.

      Since I’m not in the “older with a lot of responsibilities” camp, I can’t really outline a good plan for anybody in that situation. But for the younger people who are unattached, here is a basic plan that you can use to help guide you (keep in mind, this is just a rough guide that is based on my experience and opinion):

      First thing is to get a day job. Preferably one that pays decently but doesn’t completely drain you so that you can be creative when you get home. So, in other words, get a job that you really don’t care about but pays the bills good enough.

      For the first year or two, it will be all about getting your composing, mixing, and recording skills up to speed. Really, you will be continually learning this stuff for your entire life, but it will probably take a year or 2 just to get “competitive.”

      While you are getting up to speed and working that crappy day job, keep your lifestyle manageable. You need to spend WELL below your means. That means: no BMW, no $100+ per month ultimate cell phone plan, no going out and getting hammered every weekend, no going out to eat every day for lunch and dinner (learn to cook!), etc. This will allow you to save a lot of money (which you will need later) and train you to be frugal when you make the move to be a full time composer.

      At a certain point, if things go well, you will be essentially working 2 full time jobs but will only be making the living of a person working one full time job. This will suck. It will be frustrating, draining, and put a lot of strain on any kind of relationships that you have.

      After you sign some deals, get some placements and start making some money, the amount of time it will take for you to be able to go full time depends on a lot of things. Always plan for the worse though, and remember that however long you think something will take will almost always take longer. Is it Murphy’s Law that states “anything that can go wrong, will go wrong”? Well, when it comes to the music business, the law should be amended to read “anything that can go wrong will go wrong… and after those things go wrong, even more things will go wrong that you never even thought of.”

      Once you are seeing a royalty stream that you are comfortable with, start looking for a part time job and quit the full time job after you have secured the part time job. The safest thing is to kind of ween yourself off of the non-music income. You don’t want to go completely full time with music as soon as your royalties reach the minimum amount you need to live off of IMO because you never know what might go wrong in the future. In my short time in the music business, I have already seen all kinds of crap go the wrong way for me (but in fairness, I’ve seen things go the right way for me too). So its better to be safe than sorry.

      That is pretty much where I am at right now. From this point on, all I can tell you is to just write your butt off, network, and keep your living expenses down!

      Hope that helps somebody.

      • @Slideboardouts

        Thank you for your thoughtful response. “Grasshopper” you speak with wisdom beyond your years!

        Truly, your grasp of the necessity of frugal living and the economics of this business is great. Your post should be mandatory reading for all who are considering writing library music for a living.

        My concern, and what motivated my original post, is the older writers who are already encumbered by responsibility. They need to know, honestly, that this is not a way to make quick and easy money. They need to make provisions for other income.

        Thank you again for your well-reasoned response

        Best,

        Michael

      • Excellent insights and learnings. It would be great if you could elaborate on some of the Murphy’s Law experiences you had to help people to sidestep beginner’s errors. Also, any info about what was successful and what wasn’t in your music submitted to the libraries. Thanks for the solid pragmatic advice.

        • Well, unfortunately, all of those Murphy’s Law experiences are kind of unavoidable. Its just bad luck for the most part. Its not like I made bad decisions, or was surprised by something in the industry that I didn’t know about. Its all just been things not going through like they were supposed to. Crap happens. All you can really do is prepare for the worse by not overextending yourself financially when you think you’ve landed something big.

          As far as what has worked for me musically with submitting to libraries… its kind of all over the map. I’ve signed and placed rock, hip hop, 1950’s Sci Fi orchestral, pop, quirky comedy cues… really just about everything except for the extreme niche genres like Russian folk or Polka.

          One tip I can give you for submitting to libraries is to always try to blow them away with your music, even if you know that they specialize in doing shows that call for really basic stuff. So submit whatever genre you are best at, even if you do multiple genres well. Go with what you know is your strongest genre to help you get in the door, and from there you can branch out to the other genres. Its better to show them that you can do one thing, REALLY well than to show them you can do a bunch of things pretty good.

          • Thanks again for the feedback, Slideboardouts,

            I am also a fan of sci fi theme stuff and had wondered what libraries used that kind of genre. I’m primarily a rock guitarist, but still find it more tedious to produce with realistic sounding drums and natural cabinet ambiance, etc since I direct record. Still honing a streamline process. So now I’m using a workstation and get more acceptances with some libraries. Also, it seems that lead guitar is mostly out of style, unless anyone knows of any ways of success with that.

            I share the experience of some of the coffee folk, where I find myself getting lost in the music creation and oblivious to the world and mundane chores.

      • Fantastic post Slideboardouts!!

        I must say the biggest problem for me these days is the inevitable lure of the coffee shop. Where we composers can supposedly go and muse on whether to have that solo played on cello or viola, whilst swathed in the warm comfort blanket of smooth jazz, large espresso and chocolate cake.

        Well, that’s how we kid ourselves. In reality the life of the pro composer means being stuck at home all day and a trip to the coffee shop is essential for mental stability – and also just to remind oneself what a fellow human being looks like! I worked it out recently that (in my case) it amounts to about $4K a year spent in coffee shops.

        So, if anyone’s thinking of going full-time, remember to factor in the ‘coffee shop effect’!

        • @El Jol …made me smile. I can identify.

          You can do what I did. Buy an espresso machine and learn to bake!

          Doesn’t do much with respect to seeing another human being except when my wife is around.

          But, I can always take the dog for a walk, or pop on here.

          Cheers,

          Michael

          • Haha, owing to my rural location and lack of coffee shops, I also rely on walking the dog as a sanity break 😉

            • Walking is a great pick-me-up. I do a two mile power walk everyday (with the missis). Great for my mental state. Really!

              Of course, then afterwards we stop in Panera Bread for a cup. 😀

              • Yep walking is a great head clearer. Unfortunately in this country coffee is pretty dire in most places.

          • Been a walker all my life and do so every day. One of the great things about SoCal is that the weather seldom gets in the way.

  2. I’m a newbie, enjoyed reading many comments here, you’ve helped me to be patient and given guidance to which music library’s to submit my tracks. I started Sept. 2010, I have about 40 tracks with about 10 different library’s which I found out about here! Thank you.

    I am having a hard time waiting and worry that I’m not doing enough … I understand that my music may not be what “they” are looking for … I’m even ok with waiting from one library for my January payment … I just don’t want to be taken advantage of … so my question is how do I get through today, just one more day, of hoping my music will be used somewhere? What do you do when it feels like it’s not going to happen? How do you cope? I know, this is great material for me to use when I write music – I write better when I feel like this …

    Thanks for your time – please don’t attack me for not knowing how this works – I don’t mean to whine – I was laid off this fall (music teacher) and I want to make this my career because it really is my dream job. I would love to hear your version and upbeat take on this lifestyle.

    Cari
    ( I write ambient/new age music featuring my flute playing)

    • “I want to make this my career because it really is my dream job. I would love to hear your version and upbeat take on this lifestyle.”

      I’d say go for it if that’s your dream. Just so you know though, it takes years to really start seeing any traction. I wouldn’t recommend relying on it for income until you start seeing revenue. You may not see any $ for a long time therefore it’s wise to still work a day job while you’re establishing yourself.

      • Hi Cari

        In answer to your question, you can’t think about that. it will drive you nuts if you do! The best advice I can offer is to forget about a track once it has been completed and out the door. Move swiftly onto the next one and try and aim for 100 hi-quality trax a year. Try and get them placed with a top exclusive library (i.e. KPM, Extreme, Non-Stop, Universal, West One).

        Place them with these companies and your track will get used and that takes the heat out of the uncertainty you find with the royalty free system.

        IMO

        Good luck!

        • @ El Jol,

          I’m not disagreeing with you, but you make it sound easy to “get them placed with a top exclusive library (i.e. KPM, Extreme, Non-Stop, Universal, West One).”

          It’s not easy, which explains in part the popularity of royalty free and self-serve upload sites.

          Further, while everyone is happily encouraging Carl to follow his dreams, I would add one caveat: ambient/new age music is a very finite niche, for which there is not a lot of commercial demand. So, Carl, in addition to El Jol’s advice, I would suggest that if you want to get into one of the “top exclusive libraries” you broaden your musical palette.

          For quick reference, go to the websites of the companies that El Jol mentioned. Check out what they offer.

          To place the royalty free model into perspective, 50 Styles (Erwin), is the top seller on AudioSparx. In a recent thread he stated that he made 21K from AudioSparx last year, with 107 tracks. Go to AudioSparx and listen to their top artists, starting with Erwin, and then work you way down from 21K. Is there any music in the top selling music that is like yours? Another poster stated the he made about $2,500 from AudioSparx, over the course of two years, with twice as many tracks as you have, about 80+.

          Listen and do the math.

          “I want to make this my career because it really is my dream job. I would love to hear your version and upbeat take on this lifestyle.”

          I wish that I could sugarcoat it for you, but this is a long term investment.

          Best of luck,

          Michael

          • I’ve tried to respond, but my post didn’t go through – just as well as the topic seems to have taken a life of its own.

            I’m not your traditional composer, although I am a classically trained professional flute player with 30 years of orchestral experience. I have written on and off as my career has changed its focus, and currently I am enjoying finding my “voice” with ambient and new age music. I’m not trying to sound like anyone but myself.

            Music is my life – my masters is in music education and I have a background in music therapy. I am new to this and wanted to have a conversation about how it works. What’s a girl to do to get some respect over here?

            Cari Live

          • Yes, it’s certainly not easy Michael and I hope I didn’t give that impression.

            >>> Cari “I am new to this and wanted to have a conversation about how it works”

            The library process in short…

            You do an album. You submit it to a library. 6 months later they get back and say they don’t like it. Or more usually, don’t get back at all. Or occasionally they get back and say they do like it. One library got back to me 5 years after I sent the demo.

            They ask for tweaks. You do the twaeks as wel as 60 sec versions and edits. You send in the final version. It gets mastered. Contracts are signed. Prod fee is sometimes paid. Wait 6 months for artwork to be done/album to be released. Album gets released. 1-2 years later royalties are collected by various societies – for me, PRS in the UK. Royalty statements come 4 times a year. These are for performances of your work. i.e. 1 minute on Channel 4 is about £15-20 I think. Publisher takes 50%

            Then there’s another royalty called MCPS – collected by MCPS-PRS – paid to the libraries and they pay you (in most cases) twice a year. This is a one-off fee to license a track based on a set rate card. i.e. worldwide ad – £5k – usage on a cable channel maybe £100.

            Hope that helps.

            • Hi Cari,

              @El Jol…LOL that’s pretty much the process. It’s long and drawn out, which is why you need another option for current income.

              I think that what some writers find appealing about RF sites, is that you upload tracks and, in theory, your making money quickly. I say in theory, because you are competing with 100,000 tracks, which makes you a snowflake in a blizzard.

              One approach is to balance both worlds, if you can.

              If I were to give you specific advice, it would be to explore some more commercially viable styles, in addition to the “new age/ambient” style that you favor.

              Best of luck to you.

              Michael

  3. Any composers from the UK out there? I have a co-writer in Wales who needs to join a UK Pro? Any recommendations? Also can she join a US Pro like SESAC which I belong to?
    Thanks

  4. Can someone with BMI give me some advice. When I register my alternates versions should I register them as seperate entities, or alternate titles?

  5. Oontz Oontz: is there any way I could contact you personally? I really like the advice and comments you have made on here and, if it is ok with you, would also really like to ask you a few more things off the forum. My email is findingoutallabout@hotmail.com
    Hope to hear from you!

  7. ASCAP or BMI?
    I am a composer and writing background music in various styles.
    Just getting started and reading about both ASCAP and BMI. Would appreciate any quick feedback about which might be better to join.
    Thanks

    • @RS,

      It depends on what you write.

      I’ve been an ASCAP member for 30+ years AND I am seriously considering switching to BMI.

      ASCAP is behind the curve, with respect to Tunesat and similar services. I spoke with a board member about it, and basically got a “fart and tap dance” response. They do have a monitoring service, but it is geared to top 40 radio. I do not write songs with lyrics. I write instrumental music.

      One of my publishers told me that BMI is gearing up to go the technology route, instead if cue sheets and surveys. And, he said the BMI was going to start paying for music used in radio advertising. ASCAP does not — as far as I know.

      Hope that helps,

      MichaelL

      • “One of my publishers told me that BMI is gearing up to go the technology route, instead if cue sheets and surveys” – MichaelL

        Yikes! A re-titling disaster on the horizon?

        • He (the publisher) did say the the sh*t was going to hit the fan, when it happens.

          One reason perhaps why ASCAP is ticking to cue sheets.

          • Here’s what I’m concerned about… From ASCAP:

            “The point is, MediaGuide can be programmed to ignore performances as effectively as it can detect them. The system is not designed to be a register at a supermarket—it’s dealing with vastly more complicated parameters. It could be used to cherry-pick feature performances out of mainstream broadcasts and essentially ignore vast numbers of performances in other usage categories. It could potentially be used to faithfully capture and identify network feeds only to ignore local programming such as news themes, movies carried only by local affiliates and the music for advertising that supports such programming”

            If these digital systems can be programmed to ignore or recognize performances, can the Music Industry’s elite be trusted in being fair and/or honest?

            Here’s an ASCAP article: http://www.filmmusicmag.com/?p=653&cpage=1#comment-2643

            Kind of long, but interesting.

  8. Hello,

    I was hoping someone with better knowledge than me (which is probably most of you) could help me out with a question:

    I have quite a lot of moody cues, as in, brooding, atmospheric instrumental pieces. They sound quite similar to the sort of music in films like Heat, Traffic, Man on Fire, Babel etc but I’ve also heard this kind of music in TV shows ranging from detective / crime series to reality TV like ‘The Apprentice’.

    My question is: does anyone have a recommendation as to where to shop these tracks? Which library, or which licensing company etc? If there is a company that focuses especially on these types of tracks I’d be very grateful if you could let me know.

    Thanks for the help!

    • I am also looking for the same answer – I have Sci Fi type theme music that is also dark or futuristic-sounding. I wanted to find out if there are any ways for knowing which libraries might cater to particular show types of clients (I.e. Sci Fi channel, etc.) vs standard tv commercial clients (who usually want peppy, upbeat tunes). It would be great to have something about this on the library reviews. Thanks

      • Call NBC/SyFy and ask for your own library deal. Why go through someone else without first going straight to the money source.

        • Thanks, I’d wondered about that, but being new to the business end of things, I came up dry when I tried to find out contact info for going directly to the stations. Is there any way to establish contact for music submittal, or is there a music supervisor contact directory?

          (Also, is it ever worthwhile for library musicians to use agents, or is that for the rich and successful musicians only?)

        • Keep in mind that the reason music sups use publishers and libraries is they are qualified, known, reputable sources. They are innudated with people throwing music at them.

          There are many libraries they already go to because they are confident in the “pre-cleared” nature of the tracks, quality, reputation, etc. Also, libraries offer them a very wide range of well categorized choices that an individual composer often cannot.

          Yes, it is possible to market directly to music sups and I would never discourage anyone from trying. But don’t be naive in not realizing just how challenging it is. It’s like having another job– one as a full time salesperson. You still need time to WRITE MUSIC.

          🙂

          • Thanks,

            I guess the original question is how to streamline the search process for targeting the most likely libraries that would favor and outplace the music of a genre that a particular musician might have a strength for composing.

            Is there any way of knowing what the different libraries favor or cater to?

          • Composers are always trying to “sell” their music. Look how much time composers spend researching libraries, submitting to libraries, filling out metadata etc.. for libraries.

            In the above sentence, replace the word “library” with “music supervisor” and now you’re going direct, instead of trying to sell your music to a middleman who tries to sell your music to the music supervisor.

            Michael, I just googled the term “syfy music supervisor” and immediately found three music supervisors currently working on SyFy shows. Email addresses are on their respective IMDB pages. If you think your music is perfect for SyFy content, give them an email with a link to stream some cues.

            • The time composers spend submitting to libraries, filling out metadata, etc is a drop in the bucket compared to being one’s own sales force.

              Do you have any track record of success going this route?

              Contact info for music sups is easy to get. That’s not the hard part at all. If you did get a sup to listen to some of your tracks, the odds that one of those tracks meets his/her current needs are small and that’s what they are focused on. And they get so many emails like that, they ignore many of them.

              Again, a library provides a resource which is a database of hundreds or thousands of tracks, well tagged and categorized. Can you compete with that?

              I wish you good luck. If you are successful this way, kudos….

              🙂

              • Thanks again,

                I guess the best approach is shotgun – doing both the submitting through the music supervisor when they respond, and the library approach when they don’t.

                I just know from talking to a local PBS producer friend in the past that they get their music from one library and didn’t consider individual contracts. I had wondered if there was a way to find out what tv stations, networks, etc. use particular libraries regularly. For example – what library or libraries would the Weather Station get the bulk of their music from.

            • Thanks for the advice everyone. I think there are pros and cons to both routes – library or direct to the show’s music supervisor. I’d like to pursue the second of these, especially after Oontz Oontz’s comments. I really don’t know where to start though, I mean I could ring up Nat Geo or something but that’s about all I know.

              Another thing I’m not sure on is how I would deal with the production company as an individual composer. I’m assuming you would sell them a track on a one off fee which they can then use as many times as they like in different shows without paying the license fee again right? But then that’s good too because you’d be getting performance royalties? And I’d also need to have a contract I can present them including things like the track is completely free of liabilities etc etc?

              You know, I’m just going to come out and say it: what I really wish I had in this business was a mentor. I’m pretty young but I’m not naive, so I can see how limited my knowledge is. On the other hand I can make great music in a particular couple of genres, and I would really like to get it to more places. It’s very difficult working on your own 24×7, without guidance (other than the internet and this very useful site, but that’s pretty lonely too!)

              If there’s anyone out there who’s been mentored and wants to continue the tradition, or just anyone who feels like getting in touch, please do write me an email – findingoutallabout @ hotmail.com

              Thank you.

              • In most cases it’s just easier for a production company, network, producer, music supervisor etc. to just have blanket licenses with a few music libraries. They pay an annual fee and don’t have to worry about dealing with individual people when they need music. Not saying it doesn’t work to go that route but unless we were looking for something totally unique that none of the libraries can offer, I wouldn’t waste my time.

                It’s much simpler to deal with a company like apm and say, “here’s x amount of dollars for the year”, now I can use all of their music libraries as much as I want.

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