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Ok, got to jump in here on the tunesat subject.
A few things will heppan if PRO are gonna start using tunesat:
1) The PRO’s not gonna have enough money to pay and royalties will be much lower. They will try to get more from the networks and I think only the big ones will up the fee and the small ones will stay the same, so even lower cable royalties. yay!
2) False positives as Anonymous said. Too much similar loops from royalty free sample libraries are at use those days, so a lot of the same detections will appear on multiple composers account for something they didn’t wrote. Again, more money to pay.
3) No more Non-Exclusive libraries. The model is going to die and I don’t see any solution to it. Maybe they can do something with future music that can maybe be water marked but what with the other music circling around? If the non exclusive mode will die they will have hard time to sign songs from indie bands and acts, not to mention cable channels and budgets.
I just don’t see it happening as much as I LOVE tunesat.
Is TuneSat site down? Can’t seem to get on it. Anyone else haveing this problem?
I have the same problem. Also ascap’s site too. Must be storm related.
Both are working again for me now.
Thanks, yes now they are working again.
“I thought ascap census vs survey data applied to commercial and promo’s and not regular programming.
http://www.ascap.com/members/payment/cablesurveys.aspx
Did I get that wrong?”
@greg, I was just about to answer that last night when the power went out.Yes…you got that wrong. ASCAP only does census, or complete surveys when they consider it “economically sensible.” http://www.ascap.com/members/payment/keepingtrack.aspx
That applies to everything, broadcast TV, cable and radio. Notice that the more money a licensee pays the more often the licensee gets sampled. In the 90’s I had contemporary jazz CD that charted at #45 nationally. BUT..it only made about $100 in royalties because most of the airplay was on college stations that pay low license fees, and are therefore surveyed less frequently. I’ve actually made far more money from Soundexchange for digital plays of the same music.
The same goes for most TV that’s not major network. Once you get away from national broadcasts on ABC, CBS, NBC or FOX. Syndicated programming on local affiliates is in survey land.
You’ll notice that for ads and promos, ASCAP uses Comptitrack, a company that monitors advertising on some, not all, cable networks. For TV, ASCAP uses Tribune Media, http://www.tribunemediaservices.com/products-and-services/television/
Tribune doesn’t monitor performances, like Tunesat, and tell you what actually aired. They keep a database of TV schedules. So, in other words, a good portion of ASCAP’s “survey” is based upon what TV schedules say is supposed to air, not necessarily what actually aired. Problem arise, when cue sheets and air-date info provided by the producer don’t match, because the survey rules, even if it’s inaccurate.
Cheers,
Michael
NOTE: If most of your music is placed on Network shows, or top tier cable, ASCAP and BMI are competitive. My experience is based on syndicated television, where BMI seems to have a better method of detecting performances.
>A few things will heppan if PRO are gonna start using tunesat:
1) The PRO’s not gonna have enough money to pay and royalties will be much lower. They will try to get more from the networks and I think only the big ones will up the fee and the small ones will stay the same, so even lower cable royalties. yay!<
The PROs will have plenty of money. ASCAP does not collect less money just because it misses a large percentage of performances.
2) False positives as Anonymous said. Too much similar loops from royalty free sample libraries are at use those days, so a lot of the same detections will appear on multiple composers account for something they didn’t wrote. Again, more money to pay.
It happens, but it takes very little to have music with a different fingerprint. For instance, change the key, layer on different instruments. Just write something.
3) No more Non-Exclusive libraries. The model is going to die and I don’t see any solution to it. Maybe they can do something with future music that can maybe be water marked but what with the other music circling around? If the non exclusive mode will die they will have hard time to sign songs from indie bands and acts, not to mention cable channels and budgets.
I’m going to make a fine distinction. Retitling is likely to go away. But non-exlusive, if it’s under a business model like Musicsupervisor (where the artist keeps the publishing) will not.
During the process of switching from ASCAP to BMI, I had the chance to speak with upper level people at each. Both PRO’s agree, that retitling will eventually die. Both PRO’s have their own detection technology in development. As such, Tunesat will most likely remain a way for composers to monitor their performances.
Thanks for your opinion Michael.
That is some bad news for all of the re-titlers out there…(including me).
It is all about the money in the end. The PROs will come to their senses and use Tunesat eventually.
Maybe about 3 to 5 years from now it will happen. Tunesat just needs to keep helping libraries recover large publishing royalties that are being missed. That will lead to those music libraries influencing the PROs to use Tunesat’s services.
DI:
It is all about the money in the end. The PROs will come to their senses and use Tunesat eventually.
Did you read what Michael posted before you, DI?
Both PRO’s have their own detection technology in development.
ASCAP and BMI are not adopting Tunesat but they will put in place their own versions of detection systems at some point in the future. Exactly how this will shake out for the thousands upon thousands of re-titled tracks already registered, no one knows (Please don’t speculate- we’ve done enough of that).
While it’s true that ASCAP won’t accept Tunesat detections as proof of track usage, detections give a composer info to take to a library (or in some cases the production company) to help investigate further as far as missing info on cue sheets, etc. I have heard of a number of cases whereby a composer had a detection on Tunesat which didn’t get picked up by their PRO and was able to get a library to get it fixed.
Of course, if you have no idea which library may have made the placement, as can happen with the same cue in many NERT libraries, it might not be practical.
Exactly how this will shake out for the thousands upon thousands of re-titled tracks already registered, no one knows (Please don’t speculate- we’ve done enough of that).
That doesn’t make any sense.
We do not know what the future holds. We can only speculate and try to predict what may happen. There is nothing wrong with taking clues from the past and present to make sense of the future.
The worst thing that can happen is that I am 100% wrong. Being wrong is a part of life. I can deal with that. I can take my loss and move on. But at least I am thinking and trying to come up with solutions. [Removed by moderator]
🙂JMHO… Proposing solutions for composers is one thing. But proposing solutions for industry execs, libraries, PRO’s, etc. is (again MHO) a waste. They aren’t going to do something ‘cos YOU (or ME) suggest it.
I said not to speculate because I didn’t want to open up that whole re-title debate again. It’s been beaten to death.
Movin’ on… In the immortal words of Seinfeld’s Kramer, “I’m out”…
That will lead to those music libraries influencing the PROs to use Tunesat’s services.
As stated in my 2012 post and as Advice pointed out, ASCAP and BMI have tunesat like technology in development.
Each, in fact, already has its own similar technology that they choose to not apply to television at this time. So, there’s little likelihood that they will “use tunseat.”
Additionally, the PROS aren’t losing money because of missed performances. They collect blanket fees from the networks, based on market size and revenue. The only ones that lose out are composers, because the PROS don’t slice the pie accurately.
Movin’ on… In the immortal words of Seinfeld’s Kramer, “I’m out”…
+1
ASCAP + BMI already have fingerprinting in place and are paying out on it, but it different areas and in different ways. The Production Music Conference this Friday has a panel with Lynne Lummel from ASCAP on it – she’s the SVP of Distribution and Repertory.
ASCAP + BMI already have fingerprinting in place and are paying out on it, but it different areas and in different ways. The Production Music Conference this Friday has a panel with Lynne Lummel from ASCAP on it – she’s the SVP of Distribution and Repertory.
Oh cool. Hopefully they shoot a video and post it online. I would love to hear more about the subject of fingerprinting from other professionals.
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