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Project Sam True Strike
Cinesamples Cineperc, Drums of War 2
8Dio Epic Taiko, Epic Toms, Epic Frame, Epic Dhol+1
And…
Project SAM Symphobia
LA Scoring Strings
You can combine Symphobia and LASS for Zimmer-like stringsOn the synth end:
Omnisphere
ZebraMichael
Thanks Mark, for the info. It’s greatly appreciated.
Sounds like content ID is still a waste of time, in terms of it’s monetary return, and will be for the foreseeable future.I’ll pass.
Michael
We’ve discussed this subject ad nauseum. It seems that the root of the issue is that Youtube content ID doesn’t operate invisibly. I don’t know why it doesn’t. If they didn’t post copyright warnings, and simply collected money from advertisers, there should be no problem, and we could all participate, without causing grief for RF libraires.
I understand that the copyright notice is meant to stop pirating, but there has got to be a better way. It’s not rocket science.
_Michael
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2a8TRSgzZY (thanks Rob)
When I practiced law, and settled cases, I looked for the “happy” number. That is dollar figure at which both sides were comfortable and satisfied with the outcome.
In the law, not all cases are created equal. Personal injury, for example, generally results in higher damages than property damage, because there can be many other factors involved, like lost wages, future treatment, and less quantifiable things like suffering.
To some degree it may be the same with music. Should a full on orchestral piece, two minutes long, recorded with 50k worth of samples, or live players cost more than a two minute drum n’ bass cue recorded with Garage Band on a laptop? What if one took a week to produce and the other just a few hours? What about the less quantifiable aspects? What if one composer has a music degree and a lot of experience/credits and another can’t even read music?
If the argument here is about getting paid properly for your labor and cost of production, then the piece that took a week and was composed by a degreed composer with experience should, in theory, be worth more than the drum n’ bass cue.
How often, in commerce, do we measure things stricly by quantity? Rarely. An ounce of gold is worth more than an ounce of silver. A pound of lobster costs more than a pound of squid.
So, I guess we need to ask, what is the criteria / standard for the “minimum” piece of music? Is drum n’ bass the floor (pun intended) and full on orchestral the upper limit?
_Michael
@Advice,to paraphrase: It would be easier for an Airbus to pass through the eye of a needle.
There was that one rant so full of profanity it was also ridiculous and so deleted. Believe me I’m no prude, I spent 4 years in the Marine Corps so there isn’t much I haven’t heard. I think we can be better than that.
This is not directed at Glen, or anyone else. The issue of language is not about being a “prude.” There’s an important lesson here for young composers. Rightly, or wrongly, people judge a wide range of things about other people including, but not limited to, their: intellect, maturity, competence, professionalism, class, and simply whether the person is someone that they want to deal with, based upon their choice of words.
People get passionate about issues. But, if you read the posts of the top pros here, like Mark Petrie, you will notice that they are thoughtful, articulate and measured. No matter what the issue is, you won’t see ranting or profanity. Other professionals, including library owners and A&R people, read this page. I’m sure that they make mental notes of who they might not want to work with. I do.
Maybe that seems unfair, but, in a busy world no one has time to deal with a difficult person, no matter how good they think they are.
Sorry to go off thread, but it seemed to follow on Art’s statement.
_Michael
Glen, we’re pretty much on the same page. I wouldn’t sell RF cues at $5, $10, $15 or $20, unless you’re talking about tiered pricing. If someone want’s to pay $15 for a 4 second stinger, I don’t really have a problem with that, because it’s most likely just an edit of a longer cue that is selling for $100.
My point about India, etc, is not to expect “hungry” composers, anywhere, to not vigorously compete on price. As Advice said, they will. Still others, unfortunately are of the misguided belief that low-balling is the way to open doors. Of course, let’s not forget that the libraries are competing amongst themselves.
You and I are very fortunate that our level of “success” affords us the opportunity to be more particular about things. Others, unfortunately, see micro-dollars and volume as the way to go. We’re not likely to change that. There was a long debate on this forum with someone who was completely enamored of Rumblefish. No one was going to change hs mind.
So be it.And..it was mr composer who was touting his conservatory training.
Cheers,
MichaelNo worries Art. It’s hard, but writers have to keep this business in perspective. There’s a big blue ocean of opportunity out there, for writers at all levels. I don’t envy or begrudge those above or below.
Glen’s work for hire, $26,000 for 26 cues sounds like the holy grail compared to selling cues at $15. But, you and I both know multiple individuals who’ve made more than 26K (in some cases far more) from a single cue. I’ve done it, several times (with cues produced in a day, that didn’t require conservatory training to compose).
I’ll echo Mark’s sentiment. I wish Glen continued success with his musical career. He knows what works for him. Kudos.
_Michael
Glen you are about to be banned if you can’t keep things civil!
Sorry I didn’t get a chance to read the rant. @@
Thanks for stepping in Art, but there’s no need. I’m a big boy. I can handle it.
What I can’t handle, and won’t do, is waste time.Cheers,
MichaelGoing back aways on the thread, the notion that one could get all composers to adopt minimum standards, unionize, etc. just isn’t realistic. There will always be someone hungry enough to sell their product for less, especially when there are so many people out their who can readily make music (leaving out any quality qualifiers) at home
One obvious point that gets overlooked: library music is a global enterprise. There are places in the world where $15 (USD) is a lot of money. Just consider the monthly wage for garment workers, Bangladesh $38 per month, Cambodia $61 per month and China $150 per month. If someone living under those conditions could manage to save enough money for a laptop and garage band, who is actually going to tell then to not sell their music for $15, or that they must use real instruments? Perhaps Bangladesh and Cambodia are extreme examples, but a quick look at the composer list on a site, like Audiosparx, reveals many composers from places where $15 goes a long way.
In other words, like every other industry, we face competition from parts of the world where “labor” costs a fraction of what it does in more “developed” nations.
So, while it’s wonderful that union workers in the US can just demand higher wages (that doesn’t work out all the time), there are many places where composers aren’t likely to “just say no.”
Sounds melodramatic, but that’s the reality of the internet. I have a friend who posted an offer to have his logo designed for $150. He got designs from all over the world, including India (I think that’s where he got the logo). He had his pick…for $150!
We’re in the same boat.
_MichaelCheckin’ out guys…It’s been fun…I’m getting back to my work for hire where I am being paid $1000 a track for 26 tracks. (The client said why not $450?…I said sorry…this is my price) I still got the contract.
Well, why didn’t you say that from the start? Then, we would have understood your message clearly. 😉
I was hoping the irony would come across. that I could make a t-shirt and have it on sale in about 30 seconds while people in this thread are complaining about composers using plugins and loops to create music.
You know Mark, back in the day, you could get $100 to silk-screen a custom T-shirt like that, and it only took a week.
What irony?
What I don’t understand is selling music for $15 a track. $89 is a hell of a lot better than $15. 10 to 20 years ago no one ever had a problem paying $250 for a needle drop track for a corporate business video or low budget spot. I know this because I was a buyer and I was happy to pay $250 and i understood why i had to pay $250. Are economic times really that dire right now that businesses can only afford tracks for $5, $10, $15??? What a joke!
Glen, I’m not sure it’s a matter of times being dire. 30 years ago I was getting $100 to $200 per minute to score corporate films. Music was a percentage of the budget. Corporate films had budgets of $1,000+ per minute. In the 50’s they were shot on 35 mm film, like features. Then, they were shot on 16 mm film, then video (beta). Now, I’m sure someone is shooting corporate images with an iPhone. Technology and priorities have changed. Music is not a high priority in the budget. One of my corporate clients who produces annual meetings now uses music from a CD that he bought…200 cues for $200, because the company reduced his budget!
Like, I said the answer to your question is supply and demand mixed with want/need and priorities. It’s not whether or not companies can afford more than $15 per cue, it’s whether they think music is worth more than $15 per cue. In some cases, and for some uses, clearly they do not.
A friend once said that “you know you’re getting old when you spend more time looking back than forward.” (I see another Tee-shirt coming).
It’s a cliche, but then was then and now is now._Michael
@Mark..ROTFLMFAO!!!!!
Remember me when I finally submit….