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Do you have a system in the US with your PRO where you can see unclaimed royalties ? We have here in Ireland, I have reclaimed thousands using this, all the info is there but gets lost in the translation to actual payments.
In Ireland and I assume the UK you may register the track but only the publisher can register their interest in it, you can’t. So in light of this I would let the publisher do it, it is in their interest to do quickly after all.
If construction kits were such a great idea, why isn’t every editor using the stock Apple Loops that come with Final Cut? Some of those are actually really good!
Good point, and good editors and rooms aren’t cheap or meant for doing this kinda thing, but employ a musician after the fact to assemble the music offline to a cut and it may be a viable thing.
As it says in the vid “no musical knowledge necessary”
So its free ? but you have to log cue sheets. Interesting idea, I suppose the Beeb contributed the orchestra and studio and Universal handle the publishing.. Kind of takes the Soundtrack Pro approach to a new level. I also assume the BBC would very much like you use this on their own programs !!!! BBC PRO rates are high and ITV higher. Now if you were writing bespoke orchestral scores for UK TV this would be a worry. The price difference would be huge.
To repeat again MA I make more from RF licenses than PRO for the tracks I have in RF libraries. Its a revenue stream for me that for the most part is aimed at the non PRO marketplace. Cant make it any clearer.
Over all my catalogue, which is diversified!!!!! I make more PRO money than RF licenses. You keep asking the same question expecting a different answer.
Its like asking Apple , “do you make more revenue out of iPhones than iMacs ?” They answer iPhone and then you reply “why are you making iMacs then ? “
@Barry, interesting point, In the UK and Ireland we have corporate owned models like you and public funded, government regulated,free to air TV (BBC/RTE)which is why the royalty rates I posted for the BBC are pro rata high. I don’t think the BBC will disappear, but pressure on its funding and different viewing behaviour must have an effect on its finances. The US does not have a BBC type broadcast model, different territories will have different ways of dealing with the new era.
One thing is for sure , technology and the internet have, and will change the way we listen and view content, and the way our music is monetized will have to change. Staying ahead of the curve by its nature is speculation, informed speculation is what we do here (hopefully LOL)In relation to this in context of the thread , my opinion always has been diversify and intelligently spread your catalogue. RF is not the devil or the best thing ever, there are many other issues at play in a global context. We are in a global market place, the days of library music being accessed on CDs in post houses is gone forever. Anyone who holds on to the glory days pre internet will get left behind.IMO
I just looked this up as a possible marker for royalty rates in the future for broadcst streaming.
Spotify pays now .007 cents per stream or $7 for 100 K streams.
Now in a future where TV streaming is the norm what will the royalty rate be then.In the UK BBC radio pay ยฃ39.46 ($66.02) per 3 min song, which translates roughly into 1 million Spotify streams equalling 1 BBC radio play. WTF!!!
Interesting times ahead, TV is different I know but that is a pretty dire stat and it makes sense that a similar alteration to the royalty rates will ensue.
I would suggest that RF libraries would be the least of your worries if diminishing PRO revenues were your concern going forward.
OK I will bow out and let others chime in, to finish..
1. MA your assumption is that most of RF music gets used in PRO situations, in my experience it doesn’t. Yours may vary, I can only speak for myself. The RF libraries I deal with do make sure the cue sheets are filled out when applicable, as it is their interest to do so as they are collecting the publishers share.
2. I make more off license fees than PRO for the tracks I have in RF libraries. Important difference !!!!
3. As a total of my income I make more money from PRO, but a lot of that isn’t library music.All this tells you is my situation. It is more than likely completely different to everyone else’s .
If your real issue here is “do RF libraries demand proper cue sheet filling” then that is a different discussion and thread IMHO, and to answer your first question as you asked me to…
Because of the rapid growth of RF, Does anyone worry that some day, The big juicy TV networks may say farewell to ASCAP, PRS, BMI, SESAC, GEMA, SOCAN, BUMA, SACEM, etc… All those wonderful PROS that collect money for us and write us checks? Does anyone else have the concerns that I have about the threat to the beautiful Royalty?
No, because of all the answers I gave above. The question is hypothetical, you use the word “may” which is different to the actual case today. IF the situation you describe was true then I would have an opinion, I really find it difficult to discuss hypothetical situations which are not really the point of this thread.
Does everyone understand how important it is to be focused on cue sheet compliant music libraries and publishers? Am I in the minority on this concern?
I do think it is very important, as I said in my previous post many, if not most RF libraries are cue sheet compliant.
This is a side issue completely, it has nothing to do with most of RF models, without going through every library I would say there are very few who demand no PRO affiliation or cue sheets , the majority do.
I really don’t get why you cant accept the reality of this. Its not my opinion it is a fact, and it is in black and white in the library listings.
If PRO cue sheet compliance is an issue for you put your tracks in those libraries I mentioned in my previous post, or look up all the ones here on the MLR that do.
To do that MA you need to be a member of the forum, you may be surprised what you find.
Please not lets get side tracked by a non issue and concentrate what libraries are good for composers, whatever model they are called, and lets accept that may differ on an individual or track basis. Clever people diversify and do not put all their eggs in one basket.
In regards to RF, the most important dilemma is: will it threaten traditional PRO affiliated libraries some day? What if The BBC, and Sky, ABC, CBS, Viacom, Rai, Discovery, CNN, etc etc. all started to go shopping at AJ for their music shows and said sorry PRS, ASCAP, BMI, GEMA, SESAC etc. we’re done with you guys?
MA you are picking an extreme case here, this is one of the few RF libraries that don’t allow PRS affiliation and yes if all music were sourced there it would be a bad thing and I would be the first to inform new composers of the pitfalls of using that business model BUT
What if in the above scenario they got their music from AS or AN (both Royalty free libraries), pro money and cue sheet filling are required so that negates the “worst case scenario” you paint.
You simply cannot paint all Royalty free libraries as the same , they are clearly not and to have a reasonable debate about this we all need to acknowledge it.
If you want to go after the AJ business model separately then thats fair game and a completely different debate, but it is different model from the other two I have mentioned ( AS and AN )
http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=36993
and to finally put a nail in this midi is terrible and real is better debate, listen to this. If you think this sounds terrible then I give up.LOL
Firstly, can we have a definition of RF put somewhere to avoid this debate on the meaning of RF! It is not performance royalty free, it is mechanical royalty free.
Which is the case in a lot of them, but not all, AJ does not allow composer to have tracks PRO registered while AS insists on cue sheets if there is a chance of broadcast, so there is the dilemma in the classification of the very broad term “royalty free” and hence the constant to and fro. Composers like you with experience, have a grasp on the nuances between the different models, trying to communicate that without a skirmish , is very difficult around here it seems. I can’t see why this is such a divisive issue, there is no absolute right or wrong.
Our mission here, I think, is to inform others what the differences and advantages are of individual libraries, no matter what they decide to call themselves.Royalty free/Exclusive/non exclusive/ retitle …….
Tx for your post Tbone very informative.
VI Control you generally know who you’re dealing with
Only if they decide to show that, the only difference AFAIK is that you have to register to post there, what you choose to disclose is up to you.
I am a registered member of this forum and VI control and when I post I do so “registered”. That is my choice to do it here, I don’t necessarily have to. It wouldn’t take a rocket scientist to work out who I am, thats my choice, I really don’t care, some people do.
The difference here is that it is hybrid of sorts, you can post without registering and view certain parts of the Forum.
As a general internet forum rule , you should probably take no ones advice 100% but judge the quality of their posts and then decide if that info holds some weight. If you decide it doesn’t move on.
Not having to register to post is OK as long as people don’t abuse it and use multiple names, changing names is fine but it seems reasonable to inform other forum users of this so it doesn’t seem deceitful. Also to cut any discussion on that part of this thread its not allowed.
Denis, you talk about people taking snipes at each other anonymously being unprofessional. So, because you’re using your real name, you get to tell someone they’re desperate and inflating the conversation?
Dude, I really miss your point here as you seem to be confused.
1. I think people taking snipes at each other anonymously is unprofessional ( a completely different thread, you stored that resentment up. wow !!!!). I haven’t commented in this thread previously, perhaps you could do us all a favor and keep to the topic.
2. The fact that I use my real name has got nothing to do with the issue of using two or more names when posting on a relatively small forum. No matter what name I post under I still believe that,
Posting under different names only proves desperation really. If you cant make a rational argument then don’t bother trying to give weight to it by inflating the discussion.
I will not comment again as I think the thread deserves some debate. tx Kiwi for your contribution.
Posting under different names only proves desperation really. If you cant make a rational argument then don’t bother trying to give weight to it by inflating the discussion.
The libraries might say that if they had to share the fees, they couldn’t make enough profit to be in business and everyone would lose.
I think thats exactly what they would say ! The economics of it library to library no one knows.