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continuing to get the 10 to 20K fees for a post score/ original track for a 30 second tv spot?
Art, none of these places are libraries so no worries, but they can serve as means to educate all in this forum. They are traditional “music houses” that have been in biz for 20 plus years servicing the advertising market mostly.
@More Advice, those 10-20K fees and traditional music houses have nothing to do with 99 and 44/100 percent of the RF market place. They are two completely different worlds that have nothing to do with each other.
Your argument is analogous to saying that Commander’s Palace in New Orleans will be harmed if McDonald’s introduces Cajun wings. High-end custom music and mass market product are two vastley different things. One does not affect the other, and they are each very profitable.
You really need to get a handle on the big picture of the marketplace for licensed music, and stop worrying about what’s going on at the bottom end. Do you really think that the executives at Mercedes Benz worry about Hyundai and Kia hurting their market share? Really?
The fact is that we all compete, on many levels. Some have more skill. Some have more gear. Some have less expensive lifestyles. Everything that increases a composer’s productivity and/or reduces their overhead is an advantage. It is impossible to level the playing field.
@More advice. I’d be interested in seeing those links you posted before they were removed, if only for the educational value. Any chance you could send em over to mlhowards@yahoo.com?
Sorry if this is out of line, but I think it’s good to know about ALL types of licensing models.
You mention AD AGENCIES using this place a lot. Ad agencies used to pay me $10,000 a month for 1 track, for one spot. And there were times I made 16K or 28K ….for 1 spot.
Again, you are focused on your experience, which ignores the broader picture. When I was in high school, or shortly thereafter, I composed music for a radio spot for a real estate developer. I might have gotten $500. Later I briefly composed jingles (with vocals)for a large media company, for local radio ads, at $300 a pop. They’ve been serving that market (local ads) at bargain prices for 30 years. There are probably hundreds of companies that do that.
The top, the bottom and everything in between have always existed and coexisted.
@More advice. I’d be interested in seeing those links you posted before they were removed, if only for the educational value.
I am interested in learning more too. Can you shoot me a PM? Thanks!
That’s great Michael. I am not interested in getting into a contest of who has the most experience and wisdom in this thread. I too have written tracks for local retailers such as mirror and glass dealers and furniture stores, etc. I was paid $1500 for those types of projects.
There is nothing wrong with discussing the issue of prices and how it can impact all composers moving forward.
I don’t think anyone would be happy about seeing their track on a national spot for a national brand for $5.66. While it probably has not happened, who can say that it may not happen in the not to distant future? I do think it is wise if these places like AJ, P5, and AS put in protective measures in their licensing agreements to prevent this from happening. I am sure the PMA has done so.
bifftannen, not sure why those links were removed, these companies are not licensing companies/ music libraries/ or RF music libraries like you’d find here. While they do license their music upon request, their focus is mostly on “work for hire” post scores from large ad agencies handling all the national spots we all see on a daily basis. They do not look for tracks from outside composers to fold into their business model. Typically they have 2 to 6 “in house” composers handling all the business and writing all the music.
@More advice. Yeah, I know music houses. I just wanted to see what you posted, and listen to what the guys at higher levels are doing, and who they are doing it for. I’d never expect to just call them up and start getting gigs with them. It would be purely for education and enjoyment. I’d really like to see them, but if you don’t want to send them along, it’s cool.
One other thought…Don’t think the music you hear on royalty is not up to snuff in terms of quality and these guys at these “high end” music houses have the magic touch to oust anyone. There is some really, really good music on RF, and it should be priced with protective measures in place. So Matt, you may want to bring this point up to AJ sooner rather than later.
As we all know music is a matter of taste. All I hear is good or bad produced music. There`s good produced RF music but as well bad produced high end trailer and film music with standard vst preset sounds.
AJ is surly made for hobby video makers but of course some ad agencies misuse the cheap licences. And yes, at AJ you will find top sellers that earn as much as good exclusive pro production music writers just with a handful of easy going happy corporate tracks.
It
s a secret to me why its like this but on the other hand I really dont care that much. Their music isnt better than the music I or you guys produce.In the same time we are free to do whatever we want with our RF tracks as long as wee keep the copyrights. There are people who sell tracks at AJ for 17 USD and in the same time for 180 USD at AS despite AS`s policy.
Sometimes the tracks are re-titled and sometimes not.
For sure those companies serve different markets and have different customers.So all this “bla bla bla” about what is right or not is a bit weird for me. We are working for a very big industry and there are millions of different ways and almost “no” rules.
What`s good for me might not be the way for you guys 🙂F.e. there are still companies that sell music of this Canadian Russian music thief even though they know what he did with tracks of friends and colleagues.
So, it`s all about business and nothing more !!!
So all this “bla bla bla” about what is right or not is a bit weird for me. We are working for a very big industry and there are millions of different ways and almost “no” rules.
What`s good for me might not be the way for you guysExcellent statement!
So all this “bla bla bla” about what is right or not is a bit weird for me. We are working for a very big industry and there are millions of different ways and almost “no” rules.
What`s good for me might not be the way for you guysMaybe it comes down to fear and anger in the face of change. Where some might see decline, I see opportunity.
Here are my two bits. IMHO. The market for music has undergone a revolution in the last twenty years or so. It used to be that music production was a game in which there used to be very few players, those who had access to studios and musicians. It was not a level playing field.
Now everyone has the access, even with a few thousand dollars you can set up a pretty darn good studio. The playing field has leveled out. As they say, the wheat and the chaff will be separated. The market is still going through changes but many of the fly by night composers are moving on because the market has bottomed out so much that it is just not worth it.
For all us serious composers, it is very important that we be the wheat, in other words keep making the best music you can. The storm will pass. Keep your rates as high as you realistically can in every RF library. I have tracks in AJ but as soon as my placements go up, i will start pulling them out, just because it cheapens the market. Let the hobbyists rule in places like AJ
Now everyone has the access, even with a few thousand dollars you can set up a pretty darn good studio. The playing field has leveled out.
I agree that the playing field has leveled in terms of access. It’s the other factors that vary from individual to individual that still may give one composer the advantage over others. These things would include differnet levels of skill, knowledge and talent, as well as overhead.
I have invested mid-five figures, maybe more in my studio. I can hear the difference for certain kinds of work. Does that give me an advantge?…maybe.
I’m selling my house, moving to he country and reducing my housing costs by 75%. I drive an old Subaru instead of a new BMW (don’t want one). I don’t smoke. Do those things give me an advantage? Yes, because that means I can live well on fewer sales, or $50 sales instead of $100 sales.
All of the changes that you mention are the new reality. You either adapt or fade into oblivion. What the “new economy” of the music business requires is that you be very efficient and very productive.
Lamenting over what used to be is a waste of time because you can’t put the genie back into the bottle. Too many people who, previously did not have access, are grateful that they now have opportunities to sell their music, and they aren’t measuring what they get paid, by some long gone standard.
I love it because I see greater opportunities not fewer.
Three great and relevant quotes from choreographer Martha Graham:
“Some men have thousands of reasons why they cannot do what they want to, when all they need is one reason why they can”
“Looking at the past is like lolling in a rocking chair. It is so relaxing and you can rock back and forth on the porch, and never go forward. ”
“Misery is a communicable disease. “
I’ll repeat, once again, a favorite phrase I came up with years ago.
“Music is business, business is war, war is hell, adapt or die!”
I love Art Munsons phrase 🙂
Music is bizz and bizz is war !
It`s so true…..The one who has the best plan, weapons and endurance will always win at least if he`s a professional. Of course a bit of luck is also needed 🙂
I’ll repeat, once again, a favorite phrase I came up with years ago.
“Music is business, business is war, war is hell, adapt or die!”
or
Hunter S Thompson
“The music business is a cruel and shallow money
trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and
pimps run free, and good men die like dogs.
There’s also a negative side.”
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