- May 18, 2021 at 11:55 pm #38000domahidimusicParticipant
Art Munson I hope that you believe in the freedom of speech and let people to say what they want and of course everything that I say I can sustain with proof do not worry.
I did not accused Doug directly but accused the business practice itself that is proved all over the place that it aloud a door for “scam” for meas-lead and to “fake projects” that financially would benefit both parties the supposed “client” and the company or the individual who is playing the intermediary role but not the artist.
What is bad is that these kind of practices are presented as a solution for artist and artists are feeding these practices because artists generally are insecure and are lost on the business side of things. So they think that by paying will help them…
I stick to what I said and artist should really think on this : artist should never ever pay upfront for any kind of placement services !
I cannot emphasis how much an insult it is because that artist depreciate himself and his work and aloud to the other person to take advantage and cash in in advance that makes that person to easily receive without earning it fairly….May 19, 2021 at 1:01 am #38001domahidimusicParticipant
Doug with all respect it’s normal that we see things differently because we are in opposite sites.
You promote and propose your services and that’s fine . But I on the other hand I disagree with your business practice and I hope that I have the right to do so.
The truth is that you know very well how artist are,dreamers,believers but not business oriented persons and because the artistically act (composing) is so attached to the creator to the artist that the artist will do anything to try to achieve some kind of success with his art.
Yourself being a business man, for you having artists at your feet, artist that are willing to do anything to see example their song placed in some commercial/tv ect are willing to invest /pay /do whatever in advance…
They do not realize and trust me I’ve been speaking with hundreds of artist that the rate of success is minimal 1project= 1″winner”
All others “losers” meaning for a project you can have hundreds of submissions but you will choose only one composition so all the others get nothing in return…almost nothing because you guarantee at least to listen their submissions right?
You say that your practice is fair and what is genius for me is the way you put and present your business practice and yourself to be considered as a good Samaritan who is there to help artist and give more to the artist…and this works with artist in general unfortunately…
I have friends that work in this field that you are working but never ask money in advance….but they say how much time they spend on one track/listen!
How much time you spend on 1track listen??? Do you listen in real-time every song on their entire duration like 2-3 minutes??? I do not think so! But even if you do you ask $15 for lets say 3 minutes that in reality is just a few seconds, but wait it is a submission fee not a listening fee. In my opinion it should be called a listening fee…. And of course because Your time is valued has to be paid accordingly…but the time of artist doesn’t matter…
Do you give feedback to every artist that make a submission???I think not because you do not have time and in $15/person/submission is not profitable anymore if you have to write back a feedback ….
I am still annoyed i admit by your page of success story !!! Because i still consider a marketing/selling stuff that is used for the insecure artist who is not sure as to go down on this rabbit whole and the success story page will land down the deal!!! will make the artist ready to act to put the money in advance…..
You are using strategically this success story for your “business” because after all it is your BUSINESS! You are not here to sacrifice yourself for artist! You are here with your business to make money let’s make this clear!
And of course that “success story” is a pure marketing!!! Has to be reliable I just hope that you pay those poor artist monthlya and well,maybe for them securing continuously “deals” so that they left there their contacts and people can contact them for selling “dreams” and helping your business to flourish….
Bottom-line: you presenting your self as a Good Samaritan where you are NOT! you are a business person like everybody else and decides the following: apply a submission fee to “briefs” “projects” that WE can never verify if they are REAL, there’s no transparency never is given the name of the “person” or “agency” or whatever…no contact so it can be why not a “fake” – “briefs”/ “projects” /”opportunity” and by helping let’s say 1 artist to secure a “deal” you take the money of other 50/100/1000/artist under the name of “submission fee” that you are entitled to do just that I and fortunately many others considers not a “fair” “correct” business practice.
We never charge agencies with $15/second…
And again money in advance for “NOTHING” or for “MAYBE” should be considered …well will not use the word but anyway should not be payed by artist. If i ask advance payment I DELIVER the VALUE IS THERE is tangible, there’s and END RESULT!!! GUARANTEED!!!
In this practice the fee is just a feed that guarantees what? a LISTEN…maybe….who knows….cannot be verified….
I hope this will serve for artist and for future businesses….May 19, 2021 at 8:10 am #38003Art MunsonKeymaster
@domahidimusic: I have no problem with people speaking their mind here. What I do have a problem is when they start accusing others either directly or implying indirectly they are a fraud or their business is a scam. All of these so called accusers say they have proof but without actually supplying any of it. Interesting many of these accusers like to remain anonymous, which says a lot. Besides what would be the point?
This site is not meant to be a judge and jury and certainly does not have the financial resources to get involved in legal battles with various entities. Oven the 12 years I have been running this site I have received enough threatening letters from lawyers to learn that I am not going to be the white knight here.
Please read the “About” page here https://musiclibraryreport.com/about/ for more detail.
Bottom line, and I will say again, I would not “pay to play” but early on in my production music career I did. It was mostly a waste of money except for one instance. It led me to a library that ultimately earned us many thousands of dollars and I still have a great working relationship with them to this day.
So, it’s an individual choice. It’s a simple as that.May 19, 2021 at 8:43 am #38004Doug DiamondParticipant
Thanks Art for your response, appreciate that.
@domahidimusic, have you ever had any placements? Do you have any idea how the sync licensing business works – for real? Or do you just assume you understand it with no experience? Honest question.
I can’t speak for anyone but myself and the company I work for, Music Opps. I did not found the company, it’s owned by some other folks, but I do run the day-to-day and head-up the listening and pitching we do as well as the contact we have with all artists who submit their music for consideration for our different opportunities.
You are assuming a LOT about how we operate our business and what we/I think, which is absurd, a bit obtuse – and certainly not fair to either me or to Music Opps.
-As for the time I spend, think about how much time I’m investing in just responding to your accusations here on this platform… that you have no proof of, and yet accuse me/Music Opps of unjustly. I am simply responding to, and trying to set the record straight on what you assume to be true, and yet isn’t – not in our case at least, which again, is all I can speak to.
– I don’t understand how you can disagree with MY business practices when you and I have never worked together on anything, ever that I am aware of. Have we? Would you like it / appreciate it if I assumed the worst about you with no proof? You’re (still) lumping me/us in with all other bad experiences you’ve had with this business model (or have heard of… or assume exists).
-Why we we don’t expose our direct client contacts: Our clients have asked us to never give out their information, due to nonprofessional communication of artists, so we cannot divulge that, or… they won’t be our clients any longer. I’m sure you probably don’t believe that, but it’s the truth. They don’t want people calling or writing them to ask “WHY HAVEN’T YOU USED MY SONG YET AND WHEN WILL YOU?”. See how that can QUICKLY go bad for them?
-I personally listen to every submission that comes in, in its entirety – sometimes multiple times, and consider whether or not it will work with what the person has submitted it for. After that, I WRITE THE PERSON BACK and let them know if it will work or if it won’t and if not, WHY… maybe their production value wasn’t high enough, maybe their vocals need work, maybe their melody/hook needs some attention – all in the context of what our clients ask for and what they choose based on previous successful placements with them – NOT to judge their art. The other thing we do that NO ONE ELSE DOES is: we consider your song submission for OTHER OPPORTUNITIES we have and will pitch it for those opps if we feel it has a chance at a placement. We often cross-pitch songs to multiple opportunities for FREE for just the one $15 submission. No one else does this that I am aware of. Is this still unfair and a terrible business practice? Cross-pitching songs for free? How terrible.
-Most of our placement opportunities are open-ended, which means there’s no hard deadline and are not looking for just the ONE perfect song for that spot. Instead, we often place MULTIPLE artists within ONE opportunity… like a library for instance, or retail radio… those opportunities are ALWAYS looking for Great Music, so it’s not like it’s a one-and-done situation like you’re describing where there is only ONE winner and everyone else “loses”. Again, this tells me you have no idea about what you’re talking about with regard to how we work and what we offer versus other companies. Again, do some research before you start accusing people of things that are not true.
-We listen to and respond to everyone that submits their songs. Everyone is treated the same ~ fairly. I spend whatever time I need to listening to and responding to artists. They often write back with further questions, so I address everything as it comes up. What more do you want me to do that I’m not already doing?
-Is $15 really asking that much for someone who has professional experience placing songs – hundreds of them – into different opportunities from television, to indie films, to commercials, to video games, to retail radio, to satellite radio – is it really asking that much? An expensive cup of coffee? And on top of that, you as an artist/songwriter get to keep 100% of your song’s earnings/potential? We don’t keep publishing or PRO. We don’t even split sync fees when applicable. The artist keeps everything. THIS is somehow UNFAIR?
There’s clearly no point in going on with this as you have your mind made up, however, you are assuming the worse about the company I work for, with ZERO proof of anything. You’re simply stating what you THINK we are about and what we do, but you have NO “proof”. It’s all accusations based on nothing more than a hunch and I resent that type of mentality.
In any case, best of luck to you and know that I will not waste any more time responding to your diatribes on this or any other platform.
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